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Last Post on Kos

This is getting crazy. Here's the three things I take out of Kos's post: 1) He made a horrible, ugly, vile, unforgiveable statement. 2) He tried to backpedal about it. 3) He did try to deceive people about what he said. That said, I do not in any way, shape or form advocate writing to his advertisers and asking them to pull their spots from Daily Kos. I think we have all made ugly statements at one time or another when writing about war, terrorism, etc. I'm sure if anyone on the left wanted to, they could start a campaign for any of us who use ads to have our ads removed. It's very easy to point to something on any site that any adverstiser could find offensive. I am not excusing what Kos said, not by any means. It makes my blood boil. But I will not be party to a lynching party, so don't ask me again. I am just going to "turn the channel" on this one. I don't like the guy, I won't ever read his blog again. That's about the only advocacy you will get out of me and this is a closed subject that I will not approach again.

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» Commentary from Inoperable Terran
Michele attempts to wrap up the Kos thing here. (Capsule: he put up a post cheering for the deaths of the Americans in Fallujah, and then tried to weasel out of it). I find her post most interesting because of... [Read More]

» Time For The Blogosphere To Grow Up from Daily Pundit
A Small Victory: Last Post on Kos This is getting crazy. Here's the three things I take out of Kos's post: 1) He made a... [Read More]

» Time For The Blogosphere To Grow Up from Daily Pundit
A Small Victory: Last Post on Kos This is getting crazy. Here's the three things I take out of Kos's post: 1) He made a... [Read More]

» The rot that has infested so much of the left from sisu
"Kos is whining now about a campaign against him, 'led by InstaPundit,'" says InstaPundit: I haven't led a campaign, or called for people to de-link him, or anything . . . I just noted Kos's comments. And what bothered me [Read More]

» Where Did I Put The World's Smallest Violin from Jay Reding.com
Now Kos is complaining about a campaign against him. As Glenn Reynolds quite astutely noticed: I haven't led a campaign, or called for people to de-link him, or anything. I find de-linking campaigns dumb, even when they're not conducted by... [Read More]

» Growing Polarization from Freedom Lives
A sign of which is when people who have in the past been regarded as somewhat sane go off the deep end. Case in point Kos, who I will not link to, have never in fact linked to that I... [Read More]

» In other news, dog bites man from Brendan Loy's blog
Kos is continuing to be dumb. Now it seems people who disagree with him, and object to his virtual celebration of American deaths in Iraq, are "hate-filled." And the almost universal condemnation of his outrageous sentiments is "typical right-wing sh*t... [Read More]

» Oh, please from North Georgia Dogma
Come down off the cross, we need the wood. (One more tough guy sitting at their PC. It's amazing how much the internet adds to one's testosterone level, eh?) More. Michele sums it up: I don't like the guy, I won't ever read his blog again. [sounds good... [Read More]

» The Electric Koolaid Poison Test... from Who Tends the Fires
*snnnnnnnnniiiiffffffffffff!* Ahhhh! I love the smell of a mass de-linking in the morning. ;) It's been at least, what, two-three weeks since the blogosphere's done one? From the Commissar comes a link to LGF noting that the Daily Kos has... [Read More]

» Oh, please from North Georgia Dogma
Come down off the cross, we need the wood. (One more tough guy sitting at their PC. It's amazing how much the internet adds to one's testosterone level, eh?) More. Michele sums it up: I don't like the guy, I won't ever read his blog again. [sounds good... [Read More]

» Screw Him from damnum absque injuria
In a whinepost aptly dubbed by Spoons as ""The Passion of the Kos," the hate-filled Markos "Kotze" Zuniga writes: But the final tally was -- about 30 hate-filled emails, about 15,000 hate-filled visitors, and the pulling of three advertising spots... [Read More]

» POLITICS/WAR: Kos Theory from Baseball Crank
I generally prefer to blog on a subject like last week's Kos Kontroversy when I've got sufficient uninterrupted blogging time to unpack all its implications, but I haven't had that kind of time lately and the issue's getting a bit... [Read More]

Comments

[ed. note to Mr. Vandal: It's really bad form to use my comments to make a pitch for something I just denounced. Take your drive to ban Kos from the free world to your own blog]

What Michael Friedman did is simply to give Kos's sponsor a heads up on whether they want to underwrite such free speach. Remember, they are ALL in election races, and this could be use by their opponent.

Koz: "They're doing their best to turn me into the devil, and they're making racist comments about my heritage and family and threatening to kick my ass -- you know, typical right-wing shit."

Nevermind the dead people he pissed on....KOZ IS THE REAL VICTIM!

Referring to a boycott as a "lynching" is completely over the top.

Kos is saying he's got two potential advertisers lined in despite the public outcry.

I guess Qorvis Communications discovered weblogs.

Uh, oh. Prepare for an Instalanche. Poor gal (+^)

I've de-linked Kos, and that's the first time I've ever done that and hopefully the last. I agree with you that it's kinda scary to start hammering bloggers' advertisers over ill-thought-out remarks, but this was WAY over the top by Kos. Plus, he's trying to get into mainstream politics, which is why he's in such a panic over this statement still being out there. Good for the people who saved screenshots.

Because of this flap, Kos has gotten four or five paage views from me that he otherwise wouldn't have. I went there once and checked it out. Never went back. It's too much like a campaign headquarters.

Same with Josh Marshall. I first thought that "Talking Points Memo" was meant whimsically, but these days it is so focused on attacking Bush that it's become predictable and just bizarre. He's turned into Paul Krugman.

I need to clear the air on one thing: While I don't like boycotts in general (I still say french fries and watch Johnny Depp movies) and I won't get involved in the campaign to hit Kos's wallet, I want to make it perfectly clear that I abhor what he said, I have no use for him and I will never, ever look at his weblog again.

Like Roger Simon said, I'm appalled to see DU type of behavior slowly creeping into the mainstream left.

Kos is now glorying in his new found fame. His latest---
I took their best shot, and... that was it?

The problem with Kos is that he forgets the simple dictums of a civil society.

... De mortuis, nihil nisi bonum dicamus - Chilon
Literally - About the dead, say nothing but good.

They have been well understood since Roman times, but it seems his learning is out of date. I recommend a visit to:
http://www.yuni.com/library/latin_1.html

He sould also consider:
Dum tempus habemus, operemur bonum - While we have the time, let us do good
Bis interimitur qui suis armis perit - He is doubly destroyed who perishes by his own arms. (Syrus) (or words in this case)
and
Dictum sapienti sat est - A word to a wise person is sufficient


Rick

Michele, the closer we get to Nov. 2, the worse it's going to get. Can you imagine the angst they'll be feeling of facing 4 more years of, of, ..... oh, the horror!

I served up the wingnuts a big, juicy softball.

That's Kos' worldview: all those that object his stupid remark are wingnuts.

Wow! Mainstream democrat. Very impressive

I apologize. I have taken my campaign somewhere else. Have a nice weekend.

There is something of the pathetic in the positions he is staking out. Now that he has gotten into this hole, he should stop digging.

It strikes me as perfectly appropriate to let his advertisers know the kind of site they are advertising on. If you were spending $2000 a month, wouldn't you want to know that you were being associated with those kinds of comments? I know the two campaigns which emailed me back were furious about the association.

Part of the problem as well, is that the left does not police itself. Partly this is because they tend to get a free pass in the media; and part is because the groups they tend to express prejudice against (white males) aren't seen as victims in our society. Think about the reaction to and result of Trent Lott's stupid comments at Strom Thurmond's birthday party and Robert Byrd's statement about white n***ers. One resulted in the loss of tremendous power; the other guy remained the third in line of succession to the presidency.

I don't generally go in for boycotts, and I myself haven't written to any of Kos's advertisers (though I have blasted them on my own blog), but free speech goes both ways. If I want to suggest to an advertiser that they might want to reconsider where their money goes, what's so wrong about that?

Anyway, if there is something on your site (or anyone else's) that your advertisers don't care to support, or which they think would cost them customers, why shouldn't they be told so that they have the opportunity to pull their ads?

I figure advertisers are smart enough to distinguish between tough (or even offensive) political commentary, and morally leprous garbage such as Kos's statement.

Kos is not a regular read for me so any delinking campaign would leave me with no link to remove. Equally, I would be unlikely to vote for any candidate with an ad at his blog even were I able to vote in U.S. elections so a boycott there would be equally futile. That said, if taking ad dollars encourages people to moderate their tone that is both a) not such a bad thing, and b) their choice. If I had paid for an ad at Kos I would be grateful for someone to bring his remarks to my attention. Of course, I should have been paying attention in the first place...

Michele,
You made the right choice in not joining the dogpile. It's not always best to fight fire with fire; sometimes, it's better to stand back and watch the fire burn itself out.

You took the higher road, and demonstrated to all that not all those on the right are cookie-cutter wingnuts who operate in a lemming-like fashion. It's all about thinking for yourself and taking responsibility for your own actions....well done.

This example of hate america by Kos is not an aberration, it's becoming the norm. Kos is just a symptom. Mindless hatred of anything American is all the left has anymore.

Can you imagine the Gulags if the left actually got into power?

The link to the latest Kos whining (as noted on Instapundit) has been rendered inoperative--sounds like "Bring it on" just doesn't mean what it used to.

I admire Michele for taking the high road.

I admire those who take the low road.

There are two roads to Scotland.

"Piper - 'Scotland the Brave' if you please".

“…racist comments about my heritage and family and threatening to kick my ass -- you know, typical right-wing shit.”

Perhaps we should henceforth refer to all contemptible comments regarding murderous and barbarian actions against solders as “typical KOS shit.” Your sweeping generalizations about conservatives to spin the situation is very revealing and simply validates all the contemptuous feeling I’ve seen about this incident.

You want to spread your fertilizer on a large scale to other small-minded hate mongers looking for validation then be prepared to take responsibility for your actions and quit acting like a victim.

BTW an attack on you does not constitute an attack on all Salvadorians. I haven’t judged all Salvadoran’s based on your bigotry but I guess I haven’t been fully indoctrinated in all that “right-wing shit” yet.

Sorry about that misplaced last post. I lost track of where I was.

I've read some of the comments on the link to 'Kos is whining' provided by instapundit. Most notable, to me, were the ones from Canada. It would seem that some people in the "Great Northleft" are going to use this election as a recruitment tool. This should pick up their creeping socialism to, at least, a full canter. May all that feel as Kos does find happier, though a bit chillier, pastures up north. After all, birds of the feather should flock together.

That's Kos' worldview: all those that object his stupid remark are wingnuts.

Yeah, that says just about as much about Kos as a person as anything else in the last couple days. "They went into a tizzy, led by Instapundit." heh yeah, and now Kevin Drum at Washington Monthly, saying he was and is acting like an idiot and needs to apologize.

To be honest I feel just a teensy bit of concern for him now. Before this, he was always pretty nice and didn't go out of his way to ruffle feathers. Now, boom, odd, offensive behavior and a "I don't care!! Take your best shot!" attitude. A little strange.

Michele,

Would you mind dialing down the rhetoric on this topic? Asking advertisers to rethink their financial connections is in no way similar to a "lynching party." Given that the original actions by the citizens of Fallujah could very accurately be described as a lynching party, I think it is offensive to refer to a simple application of free speech as such.

As offensive as Kos' comments were, they amount to "dishonoring the dead" or "making an ass of yourself." They were certainly not admirable, and well deserve criticism, but even they did not rise to the implied level of physical violence in the phrase "lynching party." To turn around and call non-violent protest to his message that is way, way over the top.

Sam, Kos was the one who first referred to it as a lynching.

But yes, you are right. Lynching was definitely hyperbole.

I wouldn't discourage advertisers, though I did email a candidate advertising on his site to tell her "shame" and that I'd decided to send some some serious money to her opponent. Free speech is great, but you are responsible for the company you keep.

Trish, I liked what you said: "it's better to stand back and watch the fire burn itself out."

That's a really good thought to remember, thanks.

If someone 'goes postal', we know what that means. If we 'Fisk' an article, we know what that means. Maybe we can have a new phrase : 'Making a Kos of oneself', 'Don't be a Koshole', etc...

suggestions?

Michele,

Fair enough. I just thought that your phrasing in this post endorsed his characterization--"...I will not be party to a lynching party...." If this was unintentional, I accept that. Have a nice day.

Re: Willow

Burn itself down? It's currently in a meltdown state over at John Kerry's blog with Kos minions protesting the de-linking of Daily Kos by Kerry's campaign website.

Kos and Effect?

or LostKos.

Hmm, so blogs are a place to freely discuss things that don't get covered (or are glossed over) in mainsteam media. Just don't even think of doing anything that will jeopardize our (blog) revenue stream. How very "mainstream media" of you.

About the dead, say nothing but good.

How noble.

So every blogger who made a snide comment about the dead UN workers when their headquarters was bombed, every blogger who made a cute quip about the dead in the French heat wave, every blogger who posted a pancake joke about Rachel Corrie, every blogger who suggested that civilian Iraqi deaths were a valid part of a campaign to teach "them" all a lesson...

You're all going to de-link every single one of them?
Or you're going to wallow in rancid hypocrisy?

Unconvinced:

Kos was making a joke? Which part was I supposed to laugh at?

And who exactly was suggesting that "civilian Iraqi deaths were a valid part of a campaign to teach 'them' all a lesson"?

Unconvinced: Kos didn't make a "snide comment" or a "quip." It was his true, ugly feelings and he showed them proudly.

Just because I tell a Polish joke, for instance, doesn't mean that I hate Polish people. Further, if I make a "quip" about Kerry falling down a ski slope, it doesn't mean that I wish him harm.

People joke about things like death and the French because sometimes humor is all you have.

Kos gloated about the death of four American civilians. That's just nasty.

All,

Kos is a nasty boy. Some years back he posted on a listserv serving Hispanic Americans and Latino Americans something along the lines that one day he will teach the "white man" when latinos become majority. I have always asked him about this, and then no response. He is a no-good lying, lefty. He is so much partisan that he breeds ANSWER, etc. in his blog. Then his cheerleaders hide your comments. It is a sick blog. I no longer visit. I want that SOB to lose the election predictions. JFK is going to lose (KOS, then where will you go? Talk to Osama in a Cave).

Ali Karim Bey

A posting was made on daily kos. The people hide it as I wanted to know more about kos.

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2004/4/4/64218/14846/22#22

USC

Well Michelle if you don't approve of a boycott of KOS' advertisers, I would suggest that people do the next thing. That is, contact the opponents of those Democrats placing ads and gleaning money from Kos' rabidly leftist readership. Let the other side point out to the voting public that Candidate A happily consorts with those who wish to undermine America.

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2004/4/4/64218/14846/22#22

This links opens to a page with the header "Open Thread | 44 comments (44 topical, 0 editorial, 2 hidden)" but the text section is blank.

You know what, Michele? You and the rest of the chickenhawk brigades can kiss my ass from now until doomsday, you two-faced buffoons.

You and your cowardly ilk supported the invasion of a sovereign foreign nation for the most base and dubious of reasons. Now you're all hysterically up in arms because that little debacle is coming home to roost in the worst possible way, and at the worst possible time for Bush. Now you're all exercised because someone told the ABSOLUTE TRUTH about idiot, greedy Americans hoping to cash in by heading over to Iraq and making a few dollars as dumb-as-dirt mercenaries.

Yeah, those four Americans are dead. They're just as dead as the thousands of Iraqi civilians mouldering in graves all over their own country. YOU chickenhawks safely and fearlessly blogging from the danger of your computers are in part responsible for those deaths, of Iraqis AND Americans. Kos is not partially responsible for that bloodshed in any way, BUT YOU ARE.

Where's your self-righteousness over that, Michele? You let us know. You and the rest of SheepRepublic.com let us know where you misplaced your cheapjack indignation for all the dead U.N. workers and Iraqi civilians killed in this senseless little debacle, you hypocrites. You let us know how much stink you raised about wingnut voices mocking Spain after their terror attack. You let us know when you're finally ready grow some honor and to take responsibility for YOUR actions, actions that helped put those four Americans right where they ended up.

I doubt anyone will hold their breath.
_____________________________________
added by the lord, god and ruler of ASV:

I really do not have the time nor the patience to respond to every bit of idiocy in your comment. But, hey - thanks for dropping by!

I knew a Doug Kissmyassmichele in high school. Is that you, Doug?

...oh good. Another anonymous troll slimes in flinging accusations. Yawn.

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