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december 7th: how long does infamy last, then?

Today is the 62nd anniversary of the "date that will live in infamy."

On Dec. 7, 1941, six Japanese aircraft carriers positioned 200 miles north of Oahu launched 181 attack planes toward the slowly waking port of Pearl Harbor and at U.S. military airfields elsewhere on the island. The two- stage attack killed 2,403 Americans, including 68 civilians -- men, women and children.

Infamy, yes. Memory, perhaps not.

The anniversary of such an event should not pass unnoticed. I looked for stories today on the CNN and Fox websites. Nothing. I looked in Newsday, the New York Times and the Washington Post. Nothing.

Yesterday, December 7, 1941 - a date which will live in infamy - the United States of America was suddenly and deliberately attacked by naval and air forces of the Empire of Japan.

The United States was at peace with that nation and, at the solicitation of Japan, was still in conversation with its Government and its Emperor looking toward the maintenance of peace in the Pacific. Indeed, one hour after Japanese air squadrons had commenced bombing in Oahu, the Japanese Ambassador to the United States and his colleague delivered to the Secretary of State a formal reply to a recent American message. While this reply stated that it seemed useless to continue the existing diplomatic negotiations, it contained no threat or hint of war or armed attack.

Attacked - suddenly, no warning - by a nation we were not at war with. Sound familiar?

I would hate to think that 60 years from now the annivesary September 11, 2001 will be noted by nothing more than small paragraphs in small town newspapers.

It seems almost absurd that this day, this date of infamy, would see the front page of media websites and newspapers boast headlines about Paris Hilton and the Miss World contest with no mention at all of Pearl Harbor. I thought one of the things we - meaning all Americans - took from that terrible incident was this: Never Forget.

So have we forgotten? Will we eventually forget 9/11 as well? Perhaps many years from now the 3,000 dead will, like the nearly 2,500 dead in 1941, be just a faded memory that gets a cursory recognition on the scrolling headline underneath the latest Hollywood scandal playing out on your 24 hour news channel.

If so, we have learned nothing from Pearl Harbor and nothing from September 11th.

Never forget.


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It doesn't need to be in the papers, Michele. Its woven into the fabric of our cultural memory and always will be.

Judging by the attention that was paid to the second anniversary of 9/11, despite your heoic efforts, and the attention given to the 40th anniversary of Kennedy's assassination -- devoted mostly to the tinfoil hat brigade -- there is, unfortunately, no doubt in my mind that 9/11 will be little more than a footnote by the year 2041.

I'm afraid Michelle that you are correct. I too found little mention of this infamous day, and find myself having to remind people of 9/11 already. Who will play the fiddle when the fire starts?

Wht would they (big media) want to remind us of Pearl Harbor? They think we (the average person) are already too gung ho. Reminding us of the last time we were sucker punched, and how we took the fight back to the puncher is exactly the opposite message that they want to send.

When Japan committed this atrocity, the "America First" gang took down their signs and closed their offices. The argument was over.

I pray for our nation to regain that focus.

And WWII vets are almost gone. My own dad was just a tad too young, enlisted in 46 lying he was 18 and spent two years in Japan with the occupation forces (11th Airborne).

And the media will focus (with the 'weren't we just awful' spin) on Japanese internment and the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki without any historical context. Self flagellation has become a national neurosis in America.

It's sad, but an enevitable effect of time. Most people who lived through that event are dead. The one's that survive are no longer in position to make decisions about what gets on the front page. As tragic as Pearl Harbor was, it certainly wasn't any more momentous in our nation's history than Gettysburg, or Lee's surrender at Appomattox. Yet those anniversaries are just footnotes on the calendar today. It's a shame.

Well, there is one place that still remembers. Here are some interesting memories from the Honolulu Advertiser. And the Star-Bulletin has three articles. Here's one, and there are links to two others on that page.

And this is my experience with impromptu journalism from last year.

The movers and shakers in the mainstream media don't WANT us to remember Pearl Harbor or Sept. 11, either. All of their revision of history is failling out here in flyover country, though. On the trip to church and the market today the flags were flying from the front porches, just as they do on every December 7.

Carol and I got Gadsden tats this year....both with the dates "9.11" and "12.7". Her birthday is 9.11 and mine is today.
We'll never forget. Ever. And not that the tats make that so, but they'll be there as a personal and permanent reminder to anyone else who needs it. And everyone will always know that WE MEAN IT. And will NEVER forget.

The national news isn't covering it but local news is. I found about 1800 articles on Google news (some were syndicated reprints). Almost all were in local papers. I think you'll like the last line of one of the articles in my own local paper:
"Pearl Harbor made us mad, put us in a war mood, and we went out and straightened out the world, including Hitler."
We haven't changed much, have we? Get us mad, we go straighten out the world. Don't worry, Michele, we don't forget.

Oops. Adding an italic end, just in case... (The last sentence above should not have been in italics.)

Ah, the "mainstream media" myth. Amusingly wrong, considering if you believe there is media collusion it would be conservative and jingoistic, noting who owns the media companies.

As for the Pearl Harbor and 9/11 analogy, we've been hearing that for two years, and it's laughable. One was an attack in a war plan by a enemy country - the other was an isolated attack by a terrorist gorup for nothing other than murder.

Well, there was an AP story, carried in the NY Times. Your point is well-taken. My guess is that there would have been coverage of local observances in the Northeast, if the snowstorm hadn't cancelled pretty much everything. But I've never subscribed much to the "anniversary" theory with regard to anything . . . it's not the day it happened that carries meaning, it's the thing itself. (I know, I'm in the minority on this one, but I don't get weepy on the anniversary of my father's death. That particular day is just another day.)


If you think 9.11 was an "isolated attack" then you haven't been paying attention to the reams of analysis and study done on Islamism and the resurgence of the movement towards a pan-Arab Islamist theocracy, and hope for a worldwide modern Caliphate.

Question is, is your ignorance inadvertant or studied?


I suppose, in your mind, the bombings of the USS Cole, of the embassies in Africa and of the WTC in 1993 had no relationship to the 9/ll attacks or to each other. They were all singular random isolated attacks, right?

Sure, many have forgotten the events of 12/7/41. They can't even remember the events of the last decade.

Hey, look at how much the Oklahoma bombing has been forgotten. For the families who lost loved ones in that crime, it was just as painful as it was for those who suffered personally from 9/11. Oh well, at least we caught, tried, convicted, and executed the rightwing fanatic behind that crime. Damn that liberal media for not reminding us of this every year on its anniversary!

Pearl Harbor was required to get the USA into WW2. A galvanizing event that would mobilize the country. Did FDR know before hand? of course, but the aircraft carriers were not to be sacrificed. Sadly, the WTC attack fits the same profile. I understand that on 9/11, some members of the tribe were advised not to go to work?

Well, well, well

JED is a troll posting the same barking moonbat bovine excrement over at LGF.

We're comparing random bombings by a nutcase group to the systematic invasion of the South Pacific by Japan? C'mon - they're completely different, historically.

Why Joseph

why should any one have worried about a failed painter from Austria with a funny mustache?

Thanks for the reminding, Michele. In the mad dash towards final exams, I totally forgot.

I remember it, and I was just a small child when it happened. When I was in the US Air Force, passing through Hickam AFB, on rare ocassions I would get the chance to visit the Memorial. Almost every year my wife and I have visited Oahu we have paid our respects; the year we took our daughter and her husband the Arizona Memorial was on the intinerary. Next February two of the granddaughters will be making the trip to the Memorial with us.

Back when the US Navy was responsible for the Memorial and the ride out to it, there usually was not much more than a smallish launch. A respectful decorum on the Memorial itself was enforced. Now the National Park Service is maintains the Memorial and a visitor center adjacent to the Navy facility at Pearl. One hundred people, or so, at a time go out to see the Memorial; the decorum is not as respectful as it was. Still, it's good to see people numbering in the thousands that pass through the visitor center in a year's time.

A visit to the USS Missouri is also significant in what probably is an unintended way. The Mighty Mo is permanently moored a half mile or so south of the Memorial. It gives the appearance of standing guard. A view of the Memorial from its bridge is pretty spectacular.

Oh and BTW JED,

That claptrap has been roundly debunked by historical research.

But no worries. You don't have to believe anything that little conspiracy-prone pea-sezed brain of yours doesn't want to, no matter the evidence.

Fantasy is nice, isn't it, moron?

Big media chooses to forget because it is in their interest to do so. The blogosphere changes all this and I hope that whatever we create with it will never forget December 7, September 11 and whatever further trial lies before us.

The kind of people who work for the mainstream media are mostly trendy, "what's-happening" kind of people. They want to talk about what everyone else is already talking about. This is why you can read 500 articles about the same topic, while other vitally-important issues go totally uncovered. It is also a major reason why historical perspective (such as discussion of December 7) is so often missing from the media.


Because he ran a country that invaded other ones on false pretenses and with no provocation?


Neville wasn't worried, Charlie Lindbergh considered all the anti-German rhetoric as part of a FDR/Jewish conspiracy. Certainly, Hitler had the right to go into the Rhineland and get back that rightful German land from occupiers, eh?

Sound familiar?

Joseph -

On 9/11, a group of wealthy men (mostly Saudis) financed by wealthy Saudis, murdered almost 3,000 Americans. This was just a small part of a larger war, financed by billions of dollars. From US news:

“In the Middle East, the CIA learned, Saudi donations were funding as much as half of Hamas's budget and paying off the families of suicide bombers. In Pakistan, so much Saudi money poured in that a mid-level Pakistani jihadist could make seven times the country's average wage. Jihad had become a global industry, bankrolled by the Saudis.”

Millions have already died as a result of this jihad.

You call this an ‘isolated attack by a terrorist group for nothing other than murder’? Do you ever read the news?

U.S. Remembers Pearl Harbor

Sunday, December 07, 2003

PEARL HARBOR, Hawaii — With a giant American flag waving at half-staff under a cloudy sky, an aging and dwindling group of Pearl Harbor (search) survivors gathered Sunday to commemorate the Japanese attack that launched the United States into World War II (search) 62 years ago.

The generations that have passed since Dec. 7, 1941 have softened the pain but not eroded memories, the survivors said in a service at the USS Arizona Memorial (search).

"I'm getting too old to have feelings," said Leo Fitzek, 91, who was a radio operator on Ford Island, next to the harbor's Battleship Row (search), at the time of the attack.

About 250 people gathered on the memorial for the ceremony which paused in silence at 7:55 a.m. -- 62 years to the minute after the attack started.

Representatives of veterans and military groups dropped anthuriums and plumerias onto the water in an open well in the memorial, as the 18-foot flag waved at half-staff.

"The actions of those enemies may forever live in infamy," said Adm. Thomas Fargo, commander of U.S. forces in the Pacific. "But the valor of our citizens lives more boldly in our history."

The Arizona, which sank at its mooring along Battleship Row after a bomb ripped it open, remains a tomb for most of the 1,177 crewmen who were killed. The USS Arizona Memorial spans the hull of the battleship that sank in just nine minutes during the attack.

"You always remember," said William Cope, 90, who was a B-17 pilot at Hickam Air Force Base during the attack.

The surprise attack on Pearl Harbor and other military bases on Oahu lasted two hours. Twenty-one ships were heavily damaged, and 320 aircraft were damaged or destroyed. In all, about 2,390 people were killed and about 1,178 were wounded.

On the other side of the harbor, hundreds gathered at another service, which included a speech by Ernest Borgnine, the Oscar-winning actor whose role in "From Here to Eternity" won him the invitation to the service that was titled "Hollywood Remembers Pearl Harbor."

In separate ceremonies Sunday, two men who were aboard ships in Pearl Harbor at the time of the attack were being buried at sea.

Elsewhere across the country, veterans groups planned candlelight ceremonies in New York, Chicago and Atlanta to honor Pearl Harbor victims.

This year's rather subdued observances were similar to those last year, but were far different from 2001, when the 60th anniversary and its parallels with the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks drew thousands to Hawaii.


We're now at least as friendly with Japan and the Japanese as we are with the Canadians.

Who cares if we remember Pearl Harbor now? We won, and everything turned out as well as possible, you know?

I pray that some day we have as good a reason to forget about 9/11!

The only reason I wish we remebered better was so that we have the confidence to win this war as completely.

Darleen I love the image of a moon bat barking!

Or is it a bat barking at the moon?

Sept 11 was shocking and horrible but then to turn around and bomb a helpless Iraq( what did you lose? 25 soldiers? ) has to be one of the most montrous acts of all time. Unless we count Vietnam, Korea, the atomic bombing of helpless women and children of Japan and the fire boming of Germany long after those wars had been decided and the other 25 countries you guys have bombed since WW2.

BBJ Mullen what country do you live in? I just wonder which horrific propaganda system has poisoned your mind with jibberish.

The scary thing is that you could be from here. These days propaganda originating from despotic regimes and islamic supremecists has global reach, and fucks up the minds of americans much more than any truth reaches the poor forcefully issolated peasants of the countries that originated the shit you believe without reservation.


I will say this once to you, the thoroughly justified bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki most probably saved my father's life. He got to be one of the occupiers of Japan post bomb with the Army 11th Airborne, rather than a dead body while attempting an invasion of the inner islands.

The rest of your dreck? FOAD.

Darlene and Josh- Japan was negotiating surrender when it was atomic bombed; the war was all but over. And Josh, America has created and supported most of those dictators you do and do not like The Shah of Iran is probably the best example but certainly Marcos, Suharto, Sadam Hussein ( he was given the key to Detroit in '82) the Saudis, Marcos, Pincohet, Chaing Kai-Shek and dozens of other monsters were all friends of America as long as they let us exploit their countries' wealth. Nothing can show you the brutality of the powers that control America more than its treatment of its own soldiers. Darlene I hope not too many of your relatives served in Vietnam or Iraq because the American treatment of its sick and disabled soldiers is the worst thing America has ever done.

BBJMullen - You say - “to turn around and bomb a helpless Iraq( what did you lose? 25 soldiers? )

First you whine because we didn’t lose enough American lives during WWII and in Iraq. Then you claim to care about our sick and disabled soldiers. Trolls just can’t get their stories straight.

Darlene and Josh- Japan was negotiating surrender when it was atomic bombed; the war was all but over.

Nice lie. There were parts of the diplomatic corps sending out feelers about a surrender, but it hadn't been decided yet by their government. In fact, the military was ready to die fighting. (Hell, some of them tried to pull a coup when they heard the Emperor was going to broadcast his decision to surrender after both bombs had been dropped.)

Dear Patrick in actual fact the Japanese surrender negotiations had been going on for some time before the bombs were dropped. The main purpose of the dropping of the bombs was (1) to kill 500, 000 women and children for revenge (2) to show Russia and the rest of the world who was boss. The British did the same thing to Dresden without the a-bomb and the fire bombing of Tokyo killed just as many civilians. My point is that war is terrible and once it begins all countries, including the USA, act like monsters. Besides wars solve nothing.

Ah, the usual claims used by leftists to "prove" the USA is an evil nation. Plus the usual naive proclamation:

"War solves nothing."

Except slavery, fascism, etc. Oops.

Dear Patrick- Let's pretend for a second that the Civil war was not an economic one but "to free the slaves". Then this war sure was a failure because even today in Amercia there are more young blacks in jail than in college... it took 100 years almost before they were even allowed to play ball....the civil war sure cleared up that problem...As for facism WW2 got rid of Hitler ...but it killed 65 million and gave us Stalin...that's about as successful as
any war ever gets...the Mexican war gave the USA from Texas to California but that war doesn't seem to be over...

There is actually a bif difference between 9/11 and Pearl Harbor. Pearl Harbor was an attack against our military not civilians, and at the time we were colonizing Hawaii, it wasn't a state until 1959 so it wasn't actually American soil.

Oh, good, we've got BBJMullen, another armchair general who is using the full weight of 60 years of history to tell us what the Allies SHOULD have done at the height of the worst war humanity has ever seen. BBJ, YOU have knowledge THEY didn't have then. You know how things turned out. You know their future.

THEY DIDN'T. Do you not understand that? They had no idea whether Japan was going to surrender. They had no idea if even the atomic bombs would provoke that surrender. The Japanese had inflicted terrible losses for every inch of land they had taken. Their troops were far, far more likely to kill themselves or die to the last man than to surrender. They were training their women and children to fight with sharpened bamboo sticks. And here you are, from the comfort of 2003, telling us that the Allies should have just negotiated a surrender with them.

Y'know, with some people a little knowledge of history can be a dangerous thing. And you definitely have a little knowledge of history.

BTW, as to your comment "Besides wars solve nothing," war solved Nazi Germany. It solved imperial Japan. It solved slavery in the Confederacy. Now, do you have any more brain-dead platitudes you'd like to share with us?

Let's pretend for a second that the Civil war was not an economic one but "to free the slaves".

IT WAS BOTH. What, do you think that wars only have one cause?

Then this war sure was a failure because even today in Amercia there are more young blacks in jail than in college... it took 100 years almost before they were even allowed to play ball....the civil war sure cleared up that problem...

Ah, the instant results argument. The Civil War didn't instantly create complete equality in the racist people who lived in the 1860s, so there was no point in even fighting it at all? Is that what you're saying? That it's better to leave a nation full of black people enslaved because even when they are freed they're still going to have to struggle for equal treatment? Your logic fails me.

As for facism WW2 got rid of Hitler ...but it killed 65 million and gave us Stalin...that's about as successful as
any war ever gets...

First, dipshit, Stalin and the USSR existed for decades BEFORE WW2. It didn't "give us" Stalin, he was already there. Second, HITLER STARTED IT. If you want to bitch about the 65 million dead, why don't you take it up with him?

the Mexican war gave the USA from Texas to California but that war doesn't seem to be over...

Hey, that's right! I'd forgotten about that. We took Texas and California, and now they are rich states with huge populations of people who own homes, go on vacations, and generally act like stuck-up Americans, while Mexico was a shithole then and still is a shithole of a country. See? That was a success too!

Way late with this, but the Honolulu papers and local TV stations covered it big, as expected. There was a burial at sea of the ashes of one of the Nevada survivors.


BBJMullen, the 'surrender negotiations' before the bomb dropped consisted of us asking the Japanese to surrender, and them saying no.

Only after the bomb was dropped did they finally say yes.

Cause and effect.

Moonbat historical revisionists. Oy spare me these morons. Next thing you know, he will tells us the showers in the Hitlerian Death Camps were there to kill lice...

Come on, say it you moral relativist.

goes and takes a really big Motrin