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what the left has become

I read Indymedia every day for a good reason. I like to know what the oppposition is up to. And believe me, they are my opposition. Even when I was much farther to the left than I am these days, I still thought the folks at Indymedia were moonbats of the highest order.

long, angry rant inside

I discovered one important thing from reading sites like that every day; the only way the left knows how to refute something is to call it a conspiracy. They did it with 9/11, with the TWA Flight 800, with Jessica Lynch (see Dean's excellent post on this subject). They take every major story and turn it into something anti-America, anti-Bush, pro-left agenda. The world is run by Jews, every conspiracy has something to do with them, nothing is at it seems and the left is never at fault for anything.

For a perfect example of the far left in action, look no further than stalward Indymedia poster Vince. Vince makes crude photoshop graphics blaming Bush for everything from 9/11 to New Coke. Vince makes up stories, prints fallacies as if they were truth and lives in a fantasy world so devoid of facts one wonders if he's not just a parody.

Vince uses as a weapon the modu operandi of his kind - the bait and switch. He peppers his posts with references to the fact that he is gay, so when you wrtite something against him, he can cry homophobia. If you don't agree with Vince you are a gay basher! Is that crushing of dissent I see? Here's a fine example of one of Vince's messages:

Thank God and Judy Garland, the brave freedom fighers are killing the occupying zionists dogs in Palestine. They know that this "peace" talks are just a jewish plot to lure them into a bad deal. I'm not sure what i like more: Jamming hot dogs up my ass or hearing about civilians jews being murdered. Got to hit the bathhouses, buh-bye.

I guarantee you that the first person to denounce Vince - even they don't make reference to the hot dogs, will be called a vile homophobe. The issue of Vince being a jew-hater will never be called into question because he -and his supporters- will just keep calling you a gay-basher in response. This allows Vince to print all the hatred he wants without having to take responsibility for it.

Just like the protesters who claim you are trying to keep them quiet when you take them to task for hating the country they live in, or the people who plead free speech when they are questioned about carrying posters that call for the death of the president, Vince will keep on spewing his hatred because he has a built-in defense.

Nothing is at it seems, according to Vince and his friends. Whatever the media reports, they have an opposite story. Of course, they never have proof, just conjecture and most of their cries of wolf turn out to be nothing more than conspiracies brought on by people who are so out of their minds with hatred that they will go to any extreme to discredit those who disagree with them.

But when I dispute their version of the truth and claim that Rachel Corrie died through stupidity rather than being murdered by a bulldozer, I am an evil, uncaring soul. As long as you believe in their version of the world, you are okay. As soon as you step back and look at the Indy lovers through a different lens and you call them on their actions, you are a fool or an idiot or a nazi. Talk about crushing of dissent.

Meanwhile, they decry everything that has gone in Iraq and claim the war was a failure, but they announce with glee that a Baghad Indymedia is now open for business, never once mentioning how this became possible. If the war was such a failure, do you think that the Baghdad Indymedia would exist?

I am tired of people who express their sympathies for suicide bombers, claiming that they are doing their evil deeds only because they are forced to by their enemies. So their way of thinking seems to be - you can claim atrocity and murder when one of your friends gets run down by an errant bulldozer because she was too stupid to get out of the way, but you when a Palestinian or fanatical Muslim intentionally kills innoncent civillians by the dozens, they are not at fault, they are just repressed and expressing their anger through murder.

I'm tired of root causes. I'm tired of the way the left goes to any lengths to claim their innocence and deride anyone who dares to stray from their point of view.

I'm tired of people like Vince, who use smoke and mirrors to make their point and then use their own words against you to make you look like the villian.

I'm tired of people who hold up every word and action of yours, scrutinize it and then find some way to call it offensive. The people who want to water down the world and its languages and its history until it is all one ugly, pale color have got it all wrong. They call themselves multi-culturalists yet they are on the way to making the universe resemeble nothing more than a whiter shade of pale. Beige for everyone. Same language for everyone. Let the melting pot boil away until it is nothing more than crust in an iron kettle and we can't tell one religion from another, one language from another, one culture from another. We will all by humyns and we will never say an offensive word to each other. Unless of course, the person you are offending does not agree with your politically correct views and then you are free to call them anything you want.

The left is full of double-speak and underhandedness and more meanness than I have ever seen in my life. These are people who vent on a daily basis about wanting peace, yet call for the murder of certain people. They wish death upon world leaders, yet they never call for the removal of the very leaders who cause people so much death and anguish.

They live in their own little world, Vince and his gang patting each other on the back for all their deeds and actions when all they have done is make themselves feel so grand and divided the nation even further.

They can spend the rest of their days making up stories and fabricating more lies and propaganda and never once facing the truth: That they purport themselves to be a peace movement, but they are moved by nothing but hatred, bile, violence and antagonism.

If you want to know why we are so polarized, look no further than Indymedia and any of the far left sites that purport to be about freedom and peace. They have carved a little place out on our planet for themselves and some day they are going to die a slow death in that place, drowning in their own venom and hatred.

Good riddance.

Once again, this may be edited later for clarity


Listed below are links to weblogs that reference what the left has become:

» What happened to the Left? from Inoperable Terran
Sorry about the slow posts, I've been catching up on work-induced sleep deprivation this weekend and Zeitgeist has gone MIA again. Anyway, LGF links to this excellent panel discussion on the post-9/11 Left. And Michele has supporting evidence from "Ind... [Read More]

» Hungry like... from WHUZZUP!®
(Via Emperor Misha... he's pretty cool for a fisking warblogger. Between him and Michele and our collective stance toward Child Abductive Services... I may dump some of the liberal weenies that have been harsh and judgemental of me since Blogshares...... [Read More]


i think you just about covered everything i'd like to express myself on that subject. thanks!

i'm so tired of people who don't know a damn thing about personal responsibilty. everyone else is always to blame. they possess the self-awareness of a fly. this isn't to say there aren't individuals with some common sense on the left. they are just fewer and farther between these days. while i am pretty liberal in alot of my thinking i have sworn of being associated with that group of sheep.

i can't believe that facist speech codes are actually a part of leftist thought today. being gay or from a minority group does not give you monopoly on the truth. and if you claim discrimination everytime someone disagrees with your opinions than that only makes you look like a hysterical idiot who isn't comfortable with your own identity unless you are being coddled like a preschooler. buck up and shut the fuck up! i ain't got time for you. i'll just drift on over to otherstream to remind me that being gay doesn't mean you have to be obsessed with being a victim.

I'm a Librul, and trust me, the folks at Indymedia ARE moonbats of the highest order. Out of touch with reality doesn't begin to describe where some of these folks are.

PS- Wendy, who's got time for your anger and vitriol?? Get over yourself, willya??

Hey, now, I'm a liberal myself, but I'll be the first to admit that Indymedia has a scew loose somewhere. Does this mean the right doesn't have their own set of kooks, though? Of course not.

god and laurence simon help me, people like vince make a tiny part of me wish that palestinians do rule the world some day. just for the final moment of clarity in their bovine, idiotic eyes, when the regime that they so blindly support crucifies them in rockefeller center for being non-muslim (not to mention gay - ooo! i'm homophobic now!)

You wrote: >> As long as you believe in their version of the world, you are okay.

They have that cowardly fighting style in common,no?Face the arguments with facts?surely not when name calling and pigeon-holing will give you a false wall to hide behind.Face the IDF man to man?No,sneak into a crowd to kill women and children .I think that might be their bond,

IndyMedia, AlterNet, and The Way it Really Happened, are just too overdramatic, and seem to want to blame the Jews for everything. They make the left look as idiotic as The Free Republic makes the right. I can't use any of those sites to make a point.

Just because I thought Iraq was a bad military move, and don't support boycotts for people's views... that doesn't make me a bad Republican.

I mean, you still love me... right, 'Chele?
Makes pathetic boo-boo face

Too bad the right will always be outnumbered by the left. Too bad the right never really accepts personal responsibilty. Too bad the right is openly rascist, openly homophobic, and openly fascist, advocating openly the merger of the government and the major american/multinational corperation.
Whether you want to call it the Illuminati, or the Zionist tail wagging the dog, or the Aachum's Razor idea that the people in power will always be corrupt relative to how powerful they are, the reality remains the same. Clouding the discussion in the "conservative" talking-point buzzwords of "personal responsibility" and "small government" are blatent coverups to win the votes of those with minds too thin to look into the records and history of the individuals and countries in question.

and the demoncrats are no better.
neither party is the liberal in the sense that our Founding Fathers were. Both sides are reactionary, (never do they shape events, always they respond), and neither side is Liberal. I would imagine that a liberal media bias, if it existed, would be a good thing, forcing journalist to Open their Minds.

I suggest you all do the same.

you are right, jack. i am angry. and i won't get over myself until the left is reclaimed from it's current crop of career victims. so there. ;P thank you, good night and have a blessed life.

Perhaps Indy Media is a victim of what shall from now on be known as Scholar's first law of the internet:

1. in an unmoderated forum, the assholes will eventually drive away all of the good people. Assholes can stand each other, even if they are way too abusive for sane human.

I noticed that years ago when reading soc. usenet groups. Of course the group I was reading DID have a lot of self rightous lefties...

Dear Radical Right:

"Occam's" razor is an intellectual tool very useful in PARING AWAY conspiracy theories. It is not a CONSPIRACY THEORY.

Hope this clears things up for you, you walking poster child for clinical paranoia. Get some lithium. Suck on a battery if you have to.

I snort every time a homosexual person uses their sexuality as a shield in political debate -- especially when it's used to protect an ideology that would demand the brutal execution of all homosexuals. Yes, those who criticize with words are the real oppressors - not the ones who would mow people down with guns.

My personal favorite trick of the radical lefties is when someone who dares disagree with their views is branded as being just like the people who were cruel to them in their always-miserable and persecuted childhood.

I would have to guess from what was posted that "Vince" is a stealth attack from the inside. (Now I am not about to go over there and investigate to see if his posts are all consistent and it shows he really believes this all.) I mean:
I'm not sure what i like more: Jamming hot dogs up my ass or hearing about civilians jews being murdered. Got to hit the bathhouses, buh-bye.I'm not sure what i like more: Jamming hot dogs up my ass or hearing about civilians jews being murdered. Got to hit the bathhouses, buh-bye.
That can't be for real. Thing is, the Indymedia folks are probably just cheering along, yeah, kill the Jews, gimme some hot dogs!

Which would we the response Vince is looking for.

Where am I wrong, counselor?

The way I see it, and this may be irrelevant, is that we, as people, create our own separations.

Not that we're not all individual and all, but what we sometimes fail to realise is that most of these differences, however, important to us personally, aren't really that pressing in the wider scheme of things.

Many, including myself, see their individuality as a source of power, but using it as a source of power over others simply creates a climate of hatred and frustration which escalates to catastrophic levels.

My personality DOES, I admit, tend to drift towards the confrontational, but I'd be lying if I said that I didn't miss the times when I didn't have to fight all the time.

Most of the time, I find people with a different opinion or experiences exciting. Without variation, life is dull.

Huh? wha.....NO, goddamnit, i'm not on drugs. I think....um....

I, too, am tired. Bushed, actually.

I’m tired of how the Bush administration warned us again and again and again that WE were in DANGER from Iraq’s nuclear arsenal, except that they didn’t have one; I’m tired of how we simply HAD to invade Iraq today, right now, because of their stockpiled WMDs, which we haven’t found yet, but it turns out that’s not why we went to war, until we find some and then it will be why we went to war after all. I'm tired of being told not to pay attention to the man behind the curtain when Halliburton is handed a non-bid contract to make a killing in Iraq. I’m tired of hearing how tax cuts for the rich will create jobs and fix the deficit, when any moron in Economics 101 could tell you otherwise. I’m tired of hearing how criticizing the president’s tax policy (or any policy) “in a time of war” is unseemly and unpatriotic.

I’m newly tired of the “we won the war” types who waggle their vehement little tongues at anyone who questioned the war at the same time that things are falling apart in our 51st state:

“The looting, lawlessness and violence that planners thought would mar only the first few weeks has proved more widespread and enduring than Mr. Bush and his aides expected and is threatening to undermine the American plan.

Five weeks after Baghdad fell, Mr. Bush finds himself exactly where he did not want to be: forced to impose control with a larger number of troops and to delay the start of efforts to turn power over to Iraqis.” – NY Times, 05/19/03 (whoops, forgot the Times are traitors and haters; maybe they made that all up.)

“I'm tired of people who hold up every word and action of yours, scrutinize it and then find some way to call it offensive.” Yeah, me too. Like how questioning or objecting to the war policies of the Bush administration means you “hate” the country you live in, or that you “sided” with Hussein. I’m sure as shit pretty fucking tired of that one.

“The left is full of double-speak and underhandedness and more meanness than I have ever seen in my life. These are people who vent on a daily basis about wanting peace, yet call for the murder of certain people. They wish death upon world leaders, yet they never call for the removal of the very leaders who cause people so much death and anguish.”

I gotcher double-speak and underhandedness and meanness right here: Saxby Chambliss (R, Ga) defeats a war veteran amputee opponent by attacking and lying about the man’s patriotism. Tom DeLay engineers a despicable attempt to redistrict Texas in order to give the Repubs the upper hand with voters, whether the voters want it or not. Said DeLay then engineers the misuse of the most holy Dept. of Homeland Defense Agency by tricking it into tracking one of the wayward Dem’s airplanes. Here’s a good one, again from the lying, traitorous NY Times: “On Tuesday, at a speech promoting his economic plan in Indianapolis, White House aides went so far as to ask people in the crowd behind Mr. Bush to take off their ties, WISH-TV in Indianapolis reported, so they would look more like the ordinary folk the president said would benefit from his tax cut.” Eight years of Whitewater investigations, all for naught; an attempt to purge a sitting President for lying about blowjobs; criticizing the shit out of said president while our troops were in Bosnia, then insisting years later that doing the same to Bush was treasonous (DeLay again); screaming about deficits in the early 90s and then claiming they’re a GOOD thing a decade later (DeLay AGAIN). Double-speak and underhandedness and meanness, oh my!

Lastly, I’m awfully tired of people singling out a dopey, weirdo leftie sect and holding it up as an avatar for anyone whose opinions veer even slightly to the left, just so they can go off on a screamy, self-righteous complainfest. I’m tired of people who think being angry and screamy automatically puts them on a moral high ground. Lord, am I tired.

If you're tired of the loony groups on the left being derided, because they get a lot of airtime on websites, then give some examples of leftist sites with non-loony POVs. Give 5.

Hell, anyone would be tired after typing all that reactionary, "you do it too! nyah nyah!" grasping-at-straws equivalence crap. Can't blame ya.

Sit back, put your feet up, and have a nice warm cup of Shove It Up Your Ass Sideways.

http://prorev.com/indexa.htm (The Progressive)

Whoops, that's six. Well, I'm sure they'll all swiftly be discredited for this or that or this other thing anyway, though none of them could be described as "looney". And no Michael Moore in sight.

That's great, Geoff! Not underhanded or mean at all! Shove it up your ass indeed!


It's more rudely invasive that way.

"Underhanded," though? I thought I was being bluntly obvious enough without needing to stoop to underhandedness.

This is you: "Shut up! People on the right do bad things too! I will now point this out and thereby invalidate and/or draw attention away from your criticisms of the left!"

This is me: "Sideways."

"Underhanded" in the sense that, in order to discredit me (and not my arguments, but me as a person) you stooped to a cheezy insult. Sideways, upwards, backwards, it's still a cheap way to attack the other fella's convictions. Plus, it's mean.

In context, it's perfectly OK to use examples of lying and underhandeness on the side of the Right when the pundit is taking a moral stand against lying and underhandedness, especially when her argument is steeped in over-the-top generalizations. It's especially OK when the despicable, mean, underhanded Left (Left = anyone disagreeing with said pundit, apparently) ain't exactly in charge. The Left are not cutting taxes and ballooning the deficit or moving the goalposts when it comes to war rhetoric. One might argue that it's more sensible to keep an eye on and question the guys in power, rather than ranting about powerless looneybirds, but that's probably a traitorous thought on my part.

Why is it always the people who want to debate the most who are too coward to leave a name or email address.

One of my rules here is "Pay no attention to those who post anonymously. They usually have something to hide."

I have nothing to hide 'cept my ineptness at posting on these things. I dunno what I clicked wrong, but I was wondeirng what happened to my name.

So. Here ya go!

Why are you taking yourself so seriously, Cap'n Anonymous? You really think I was trying to "discredit" you?

For every supposed example of Michele's hypocrisy or overgeneralization on that you tried to point out, your sorry, sticky-faced-with-tears rebuttal contained its match.

When did Michele state that "questioning or objecting to the war policies of the Bush administration means you “hate” the country you live in, or that you “sided” with Hussein?" She didn't. Y'know who she's talking about when she expresses her frustration at people who say they hate America? People who say "I hate America." People who say "BusHitler" and "BusHussein."

Do you say things like that? No? Then you can sit down and enjoy that steaming cup of Shove It, because she's not talking about you. She is, however, talking about the great wide asshole of the political spectrum, the Extreme Left. We seem to hear a lot more from the Extreme Left from the Sensible, Rational Left these days. So people write about it. Because it's so fantastically fucking stupid.

(PS- Sorry to put words in your mouth, Michele.)

"We seem to hear a lot more from the Extreme Left than we do from the Sensible, Rational Left these days" is what it should be. Go me.

I like how Geoff critiques my argument so succinctly, yet defends "shove it up your as (sideways)" as acceptable discourse. This is true only if you're Geoff, I'll bet - if I told Michele to "shove it up her ass (frontways)", I'd be for a severe and appropriate e-asskicking. Or is that grasping-at-straws equivalence crap?

Michele jumps back and forth between "Left" to "Extreme Left" so much in her rant that it was hard to keep up. I merely commented on what I thought she was saying. The rant is, in fact, entitled "Comment on what the left has become".

Take my point as this: the Extreme Right is more of a threat to us citizens than is the Extreme Left, who get so much press precisely because of their extreme stupidity, which makes for more entertaining media. Otherwise, those kooks are pretty much powerless. The mean, underhanded Extreme Right kooks are anything but.

In retrospect, I shoulda let just Treacher speak for me. He made my point way up the page, damn the li'l bastid.

John, I should have clarified at each point I said "left" that I am talking about the FAR left. I thought I had made that pretty clear.

I will be doing a similar entry on the FAR right and how similar the two extreme sides are in their way of thinking.

Just because I deride the extreme left does not mean I am a fan of the other side.

Fair enough. I was certainly reacting to general current attacks on the Left as much as I was to your rant, so no doubt I could have bene more clear.

JohnE- Let me be more clear: I wasn't critiquing your argument. The far right does idiotic things too. My point wasn't that Far Right = Saintly, Far Left = Should All Be Murdered. I was critiquing you, personally, for making such an argument in the first place, because that's all I seem to see these days:

Someone argues that the far Left is comprised of assheads, and then someone else comes along and provides examples of the far Right being assheads ***as if that takes away from what the original argument was about.***

It doesn't. It reads as a hurtful, knee-jerk reaction to statements that hit too close to home. I've seen enough of such things to last me seventy lifetimes.

"Acceptable discouse" goes right out the fucking window when you can't even talk about what's being talked about without saying "but they do it too, but they do it too!!" Hence: pointless, discussion-retarding equivalance. Hence: my inflammatory comments.

Geoff, one more time - my argument was not merely a "they do it too!" exercise. It was intended to make the point that the ideologues CURRENTLY RUNNING THINGS are engaged in underhanded chicanery and lying, and that they are in a better position to make things awful for you and me than the Extreme Left are. I KNOW what you're talking about, I've seen and derided it myself. Note that not one of my examples was an attack on the Joe Sixpack Right Wing population, or on dopey Extreme Right Wing pundits but specifically on the guys in power.

In a debate, it's generally good form - and good sense - to critique the argument, not the arguer. To say "I wasn't critiquing your argument... I was critiquing you, personally" shows either a clear misunderstanding of the nature of debate or an inability to argue rationally. You'd be better off affecting my ideas or persuading me to your point of view (the goal of intelligent debate) than by doing the former, and you have no hope in hell of swaying me in any way using the latter. Knock yourself out, though.

"than by doing the former" should say "doing the former". Motormouth.

To sum up: Too often, it goes like this--

Righty: "Clinton was an asshole."

Lefty: "Yeah? Well, Bush is an asshole."

Righty: "I don't think Bush is an asshole for reasons A,B, and C."

Lefty: "I say that Bush is an asshole because of reasons X, Y, and Z."

...and suddenly, the discussion that started out about Clinton is now about Bush. The conversation about Clinton that should have happened... hasn't happened.

What went wrong?

Someone decided that instead of tackling the issue at hand, they would rather just steer the discussion in a direction that they would feel more comfortable with. And you know what's startling? What's startling is the number of times this happens because Lefty knows that what's being said is more or less true and would rather indulge his/her rightwing-hating-sweet-tooth than defend the idiocy of their own side.

Because it's hard to rationally defend such staggering, mind-shattering idiocy.

I decided to stop playing the Left's game a while ago, and I sure as shit don't miss it. Now I try to restrain myself from making simple inflammatory personal attacks except in cases that are similar to the one I've described above, because there's virtually no point in doing otherwise. To try and have a rational discussion with someone who'd rather tick off a laundry list of offenses of the Right than give more than a cursory nod to what's been said about the Left... it's a waste of time. They obviously don't wanna hear it.

"It was intended to make the point that the ideologues CURRENTLY RUNNING THINGS are engaged in underhanded chicanery and lying, and that they are in a better position to make things awful for you and me than the Extreme Left are."

Point taken.

Take this as a counterpoint, if you will, or as an irrelevant comment, if you won't:

Universities. Vast majority of professors and educators are registered Democrats. Pervasive Marxist thought abound. Big buildings and huge campuses that churn out class after class of likeminded young "progessives."

The people in the White House aren't the only folks with power and influence. They're not the only ones in a position to fuck everything up.

(What I just did was an example of what I illustrated briefly before: I paid a penny's worth of attention to what you said, and then gave my own example from the other side. Did it infuriate you as much as it would infuriate me? Probably not.)

Nothing you've said has infuriated me. I do prefer the level of argument you just now displayed from what came before. Nicely done.

Arrogant, dumbass, Marxism-spewing college kids generally Grow Up and Get Over Themselves when they enter the real world. Arrogant, dumbass, doublespeak-spewing adults running the country are far less prone to change (this includes Clinton).

When Noam Chomsky gets elected to Speaker of the House, I promise to be just as responsive to his dopey extremes. Until then...

I can't help but wonder what he does with the hot dogs after they've been "up there". On second thought, never mind.

Michele, I couldn't agree with you more about the similarities between the far left and the far right. It's really a sort of symbiotic relationship - each needs the other in order to justify its own existence.

The phenomenon is pretty easily understood, but coming up with a solution is another matter altogether...

It pays to google yourself once in a while. Hey I never said half the cr*p that I'm purported to have said!

anti-Racist here, and even on board for a two-state solution!

I'm a bit late getting into this, as I'm relatively new to blogs and interactive comment forums(I actually think it's cool, this chat room atmosphere in which people can debate their points).
At any rate, just to put my own $.02 in, I now live in San Francisco, which is the only city in the U.S. whose roster of elected politicians is consistantly comprised of liberals. There are NO Republicans ever holding city offices here, and rarely even any conservative Dems. Two party system, indeed.
The policies cranked out by the city supervisors(the local title for city council members) and the mayor are all one sided, guess which side?
The courts favor the interests of gay people and the "friends of the library" crowd in every applicable issue, law enforcement here is selective in that regard and anyone who doesn't subscribe to the liberals' agendas is viewed as something along the lines of a "redneck". There is no perceived middle ground.
Among the benefits of S.F. city employees is that of having a complete, soup- to- nuts sex change at the taxpayers' expense should one be less than satisfied with ones' gender. During the antiwar protests over Iraq, the city was very slow about clearing major intersections where protestors were keeping buses and street cars from moving, ambulances from getting through on the way to save lives and other citizens from going about their respective business. Vandalism was cheered on by watching protesters and went mostly unchecked.
This is a prime example of liberals having their political "day in the sun", and also an example of what we would have if they ran the federal government.
If you watch C- Span, where they show Congress in action, you see a lot of Republicans putting forth constructive ideas and working on important issues, and you see a lot of Democrats contributing criticism or blatantly taking potshots at their political opposition, but you hear no solid contributions from those Dems, because they have nothing to contribute.... They stand for nothing and care only about becoming the political power they were back when they had something to say.
Unfortunately, they draw all their ammo from the platitudes of their liberal constituency, which accomplishes nothing more than the packaging of Dems and liberals together as a single inept political entity with the so- called far left fanatics functioning, in most cases, as their spokespersons.
While acknowledging that there are, indeed, extremists on both ends of the U.S. political spectrum, I must also say that those who are Republicans are at least checked by their more moderate and responsible colleagues, while the Dems allow THEIR fanatics total free reign to the point of supporting them when they're called to task for their politically selfish, quasi- treasonous idiotics.
Luckily, going back to the top of this comment, we have San Francisco to hold up as a model of a liberal run society. There is barely an iota of the robust charactar and relaxed, sincerely compassionate, affable disposition one found among the general population two decades ago, it is a high stress quagmire for two thirds of the local citizens here. Shopping cart traffic is on the verge of rivaling that of cars in the streets, the undomiciled(a little PC, there) defecate on sidewalks and in doorways with impunity and panhandle as aggressively as they please; Despite the city being a job fare for anyone but caucasian males without disabilities and also the most heavily staffed in the nation, including in those rolls more street sweepers than I've seen in any other city, the streets are filthy. On the last election ballot, there were volumes of propositions addressing liberal special interest issues and less than a handful of venues regarding improvement of the city's economy, safety or quality of life.
In short, it is difficult for me to pay any respectful attention to anything the Democrats or their liberal associates feel the need to bitch about. Living in San Francisco, I am all too familiar with the direction in which those assholes would take the United States if they ever held both the White House and majorities in both houses of congress at the same time.
So to hell with a hot dog, let 'em use a whole kielbasi.